Amen!  Matt, your accounts are accurate. Thank you for bringing in scripture and The Book of Church Order in your commentary. These actions by Jennifer Kennedy Cassidy are unprofessional, unethical, and in fact, slanderous.  They indeed tarnish the Kennedy name.  I pray for resolve in a Christian manner by all parties concerned.  Thank you for your passionate and accurate commentary.

Tec

Thankyou for your thoughtful post, Matt. If I may add just one of the things that made me believe that the hand of God was truly guiding Rev. Tchividjian's call to CRPC: Those readers who are not familiar with his background may not know that his full name is William Graham Tullian Tchividjian. The "William Graham" is in honor of his maternal grandfather, Billy Graham. In 1974, Dr. Kennedy invited Billy Graham to preach the dedication sermon during Coral RIdge Presbyterian Church's first Sunday Service.  And now, 35 years later, his grandson has been installed as only the second pastor in that great church's history. Does anyone really believe that this is simply "coincidence"? I hope all readers will join us in crying out to God for the peace, purity, and unity of the congregation at this time.

 Thank you for posting this blog in defense of Tullian.

As his mother it is painful to watch this attack. However, I knew from the first, this merger would make Satan very angry.

When many churches are splitting, CRPC and New City chose to merge. What a testimony! What a great legacy to Dr. Kennedy!

Dr. Kennedy was so faithful to The Faith and the spreading of The Gospel and CRPC always a landmark reminding all who live in Ft. Lauderdale and beyond of this fact.

Dr. Kennedy  also took a special interest in Tullian when he returned to South Florida to plant a church inviting him to his office and encouraging him. As a mother I was very appreciative of this.

At the moment, I am in NC with Kim and the children. This is a difficult time for all of us, but we know the Lord will prevail. As we visit with my elderly father, he never fails to offer prayer for Tullian, the Church and also for Jennifer, that her heart would be softened. She must have a hurting heart and mine goes out to her.

Given a chance, I think she would come to love and enjoy both Tullian and Kim as friends and as co workers for the Kingdom.

Again, from a mother's heart......Thank You.

Tullian's Mom

 Matt,

First, please send the link for your blog to all of the staff at CRPC that you can so that they all feel the support that you and others pour out here.  

Now to the issue - here here!!  Without repeating the initial post or above responses, I will move on to another observation about Tullian and the obvious indwelling of the Holy Spirit in this profoundly humble man of God.  He is seemingly passionate in everything he says and does, and yet his anger in defending against the recent attacks has been entirely God-centered not self-centered.  He stands in the pulpit (or even teaching other classes or in private conversations) and he talks about embracing our enemies, while those very enemies are staring at him.  I know that Tullian is just a man...the beauty is that he does too.  He doesn't defend himself, because God's got that covered.  Although we need to rally around those who preach God's gospel (this includes far more than just Tullian at CRPC), we need to do so in love and not animosity.  I marvel at the lessons Tullian and other staff are teaching us on how to be God-honoring Christians even when angry.  God promises that the Christian life will not be easy.  He also promises to provide all we need.  Fear not, His mighty hand of protection does not grow weary.  What an awesome God we serve!

As a minister's wife, I am all too familiar with the damage just a small minority can do to a minister and a church.  I dont care if you go to large urban church or, like me, belong to a small rural church with cows grazing just 100 feet from the sanctuary.  Satan is a work to seek and destroy both large and small.  I truly believe God has used persecution to spread the gospel and grow the church and it is my prayer he will use this circumstance for His glory as well.  My prayers go out to CRPC and its members - all of them.

 I have read the 5-page complaint letter over several times and I can honestly say that this long, drawn out laundry list of Tullian's alleged shortcomings doesn't seem to contain so much as one single, solitary sin.  Besides containing nothing of substance the whole tone of this letter and the manner in which it was disseminated show very clearly that the whole intent was to cause strife, division and outright pain.  It's easy for me to imagine Satan's henchmen high-fiving each other and cheering when it was sent out.

Still, God has His own way of turning things meant for harm into things that do nothing but point to His glory and I have no doubt this will be the same.  I sincerely hope that all of us pray fervently for Pastor Tullian and for the Session during this week.  Pastor Tullian has shown himself to be a man of God and I have no doubt he will come through this ordeal as a stronger man.  This is my prayer . . . 

 What a great post!  Thanks for taking the time to write such a complete and detailed accounting of what is going on within CRPC.  In a short space you managed to touch on every aspect of this case including both the Bible and the Book of Church Order.  Well done!.  

Pastor Tullian and the other leaders of the church are in need of all our prayers this week and we must not be slack in this.  Also, as Gigi Graham pointed out in her comments, we must pray for Jennifer Cassidy and the others who signed on to this letter.  Their hearts are obviously in need of the love of Christ.  I have complete faith that God's perfect will for the church will be accomplished in this.

I, too, echo the comments of everyone above and especially the pressing need for prayer in this whole matter...  for Pastor Tullian, for the Session and Elders, for the church, and, yes, especially for those who signed this letter and who may actually sign and send the petitions in.  We must be fervent in prayer this week leading up to the meeting on Friday and in the days that follow as well.

Our church is definitely under attack.  This just makes me think how much Satan hates this merger of God's people.  Satan would love to see this divide us and rip us apart.  What incredible things God must have in store for CRPC!  We must be diligent and prayerful during these days...

I'm reminded of Romans 8:28 which states: "And we know that for those who love God all things work together for good, for those who are called according to his purpose."

Also, Genesis 50:20, where Joseph states," As for you, you meant evil against me, but God meant it for good..."

May God use this to make our church fall on our faces even more before him and bind us closer.  To Him be the glory...

A few observations and questions. First, 91% of the church voted in favor of the merger and the calling of Tchividjian. I really don't think anyone in this 91% (who voted for Tchividjian), are unsatisfied with his service to the church. The remaining 9% can be placed in one of three categories. Some may have left, either immediately or after a small trial period, they simply left the church (because that is what people do when they are unhappy where they are worshiping at). Some, like Cassidy, have stuck around and are now trying to raise a mutiny against Tchividjian. And others have stuck around and are now happy with Tchividjian (raising the 91% approval ratings).

With Tchividjian's high approval numbers undoubtedly higher than they were when he first began, it really does make one wonder what Jennifer Cassidy hopes to accomplish with all this. She has to know that if she has her way and Tchividjian got the boot then the whole of the church will go into instant disarray. Most would probably leave or try to fight it out, but the end would be complete division and disunity.

Any one of us, in a similar situation, would have simply left to find another church more suitable. Cassidy is on a crsuade, however, and her actions prove that this is personal. There's just too many pejorative phrases in the letter for me to think otherwise. "Plundering the church" and calling the elders ignorant come to mind in this regard but the whole tone of the letter is both personal and negative; not at all filled with love and the desire to reclaim a wayward brother (from their point of view).

Matthew Stated 3 things we can do:

1)      Pray;

2)      If you are a member of CRPC, express your support for Tullian Tchividjian. He and his family must be having a difficult time with all of this. A word of encouragement can go a long way;

3)      Squash these rumors. Do not let them spread and do not let them go unchallenged.

I would like to suggest a fourth step of action for those of you are members of CRPC. Show up to support Tchividjian in the congregational meeting being held on Friday. Show up with your friends and family and speak up on his behalf. It will look much better if he doesn't have to defend himself but has everyone else (members, elders, etc.) come to his defense instead. Don't let him say a word and don't make the opposition feel silly for even bringing up this drivel. And do it confidently because greater is He who is in you than he who is in the world (1 John 4:4)

I just noticed something about my previous comment:

"Don't let him say a word and don't make the opposition feel silly for even bringing up this drivel."

should be

Don't let him say a word and make the opposition feel silly for even bringing up this drivel.

I think your first attempt was better.

I am not a member at CPC but was able to attend one Sunday when visiting family in Fort Lauderdale.  I wasn't sure what to except from Tchividjian as I had attended a few sermons from Dr. Kennedy in the past.

Overall, I thought Tchivdnian did great. His sermon was powerful and meangingful.  He represents the same values and principles as Dr. Kennedy but also connects well with the younger crowd.

I pray his congregation heals from this discord and that he continues to grow in unity with CPC.

Rock on Brother! Well Done.

 One of the many principles I first learned when I was a new Christian went something like, "God doesn't use an untested vessel".  In other words, God will many times test His chosen vessel before performing mighty works through him.  Moses was tested in the desert, the Israelites were tested in the wilderness and even Jesus was tempted after His baptism.  There are clearly many more examples but you get the point.

Brother Tullian, take heart and know that God will lift you up.  I really believe God is testing both you and the church in preparation for a great ministry and I eagerly await the conclusion of your trials and the commencement of a long and successful ministry at Coral Ridge.  Many of us are praying constantly for God to perform mighty works through you at this magnificent church both now and in the future.  God Bless!!

Why she didn't include "Tullian doesn't wear a robe" in her list of grievances?

Thanks for the update brother.  Matt, you write, "The only conclusion I can reach is that they really wanted to cause trouble. Their efforts (in writing the letter) were designed specifically to cause dissension within the congregation and personal pain to Tullian and his family."  Matt, I encourage you to be more careful about impugning Jennifer's motives as such.  Surely you don't believe her end goal is merely trouble and pain to Tullian.  Sadly, that may be the end result, but right or wrong, she must believe she's doing what's in the best interest of the church, that Tullian wasn't the right man for the job, and that perhaps there was a better candidate for the position. Surely this is a better guess at her motives than simply chaos and pain.  Bottom line:  critique her means, not her motives.  I look forward to seeing resolution soon so that all parties involved may move on with their lives.     

He told me he was wearing a Dallas Cowboys shirt to church.

Matt - very very very well put . . . completely on point! We all should learn from this situation that Satin doesn't like what is going on - that is a re-birth of CRPC!! We need to pray and protect our church and its pastor. In the end these people are not willing to yield to the leadership of the church which has spoken authoritatively - you can dissagree but when you create and fester dissention in the body, that crosses the line Biblically . . . no matter what the intended motive.

Sounds like Jennifer Kennedy Cassidy needs heart surgery instead of brain surgery.

Thanks for your excellent rebuttal of the Cassidy contingent. It was well organized and spot on.

 just sayin - what's up with that 'drivel' talk about the drivel yo!?

lol, y'know

This is a very painful time for all involved. Putting Motives aside because only the Lord can truly judge the motives of man's heart  we need to be putting on Grace. It grieves my heart to see such division in the body. Lets be more concerned that our motives are right before the Lord than our opinions. Lets treat each side with love and respect. Lets avoid name calling, there is a quote that says "Jennifer needs heart surgery not brain surgery" who doesn't need heart surgery?   Be cautious about taking sides, lets not be on Jennifer's or Tullian's but on the Lord's side. We need to watch our words because we will be judged by them. On Friday I urge all who can attend the Town House Meeting  to go prayed up and to speak and act in a way that will be glorifying to God. Remember that we are all family, so lets treat one another as we want to be treated. Turn the other cheeck when needed and make it a point to love those who disagree with us. I pray that the Spirit will bring healing and reconcilliation to all involved.

A sister in Christ

A sister in Christ,

I couldn't agree more with your comments.  Thank you for pointing out that we ALL need heart surgery.  That is so true!  I have been very grieved over this as well, as I'm sure God must be.  We definitely need to pray, pray, pray (as I previously mentioned) for ALL involved.  Thanks again for your comments.

Matthew, Thanks for summarizing the issues so thoroughly and calling the Saints to prayer. Reading the letter hurt my heart, but it's so absurd in its allegations that I don't think many will fall for it. Tullian is one of the most gospel saturated preachers I've ever heard, and for Cassidy & Co. to imply otherwise is crazy. Let's pray that what man (or woman) intended for evil, God will use for good in rallying the troops to show support for our faithful pastor.

Matthew Cochrane,

I am sure you intentionally forgot to add to your post that according to the Book of Church Orders 25-2 a PCA member/congregation has every right to bring forth a petition. Maybe you should read it for yourself because I am also sure you know it would be smart for you, who is falsely accusing those who don't share your same mind, to know that side along with the one you stand for.

As a humble Christian, (I assume), you should make sure you correct yourself.

Additionally, since you seem to enjoy blaspheming Jennifer Kennedy Cassidy for the right she did according to the rights given to her, you, Matthew, did not follow Matthew 18 like you posted that Jennifer should have done. It seems you don't know the whole picture, (and you definitely do not), about anything going on in the church about this issue. You are using the World Wide Web, which is not the brother or sister you are having problems with, to post your problems that you are having with another person.

Have you ever tried calling Jennifer to share your feelings or is that too hard for you to do?

Let me just remind you that knowing half the truth is the same as knowing none of the truth. Go and make sure you know with solid facts, just like Jennifer did, about an issue BEFORE misleading others along with yourself.

I guess I'm not sure why the "nay-sayers" don't put their names on their posts, while most of the other people who posted did.  If you are going to post, put your name so you show you stand behind your statements. 

A completely outside observer,

Geoff Dennis

What did Tullian say last Sunday?

"God is on the side of those who fall on their face before him and ask for help." 

With all due respect, there is far more power in that  statement than anything currently written on this particular post, with exception toTullian's mom's contribution. Strife can take many forms, but it always pits one person against another and I find that incredibly dangerous within the body of Christ; destroyed relationships are not a product of a committed Christian walk.Gigi, has the right heart towards Jennifer, and that is the same heart we ALL need to have towards those whom Satan has been able to grip in this mess for his insidious evil.

I am a HUGE fan of Tullian, as is my husband. We have met with him personally and we were blessed beyond what we anticipated (and we anticipated a lot!) needless to say, we support him whole heartedly.

For the sake of the cross though, I believe we would all do well to "Be still and know that He is God," and trust Him with all of this allowing our opinions to rest at the feet of Jesus, where they belong.

Sincerely and With Great Respect,

Robin Revier

www.broadjam.com/chicky

you know what? this is the reason why people attend non-demoninational churches. People are getting tripped up over this subset or that subset of church order. Looks like church order has led to church disorder. That's focus of what the Bible says. The opposition in this case will not win. Tullian has too big a support network for these folks to win. Their cause will be refuted with what God's already done and what He will do. The folks that quote this or that subset of the Church Order are not mentioning scripture. Why does it concern you? person.....you're using the internet to blashpheme Matt. I think that's the pot calling the kettle black. LET'S PRAY THAT GOD DOES A MIGHTY WORK THROUGH TULLIAN. For every against post I see I'm going to post a for post.

A Sister in Christ,

Your comments are spot on.  I hope more readers of this blog take your advice.

Geoff,  to answer your question/comment, sometimes people can't put their names on a post because of the jobs they hold (e.g. positions in a church). By placing your name, you may risk a job.  As an outside observer, you don't risk that.  So you're right to put your name.  But at the same time, we should be more interested in the content of the message and not who the messenger is.  We don't need to be forming sides.

I am appaled at the visciousness of your blog and the attack on Jennifer Cassidy.  Never once do you mention that the letter was written and signed by several other individuals.  Why the attack on Jennifer?  As a long time member of CRPC, I am dismayed over this entire controversy.  Many of your comments and those of other blogger indicate a lack of knowledge about what is truly transpiring.  God is surely not pleased and neither are a GREAT many other members - those who came to Coral Ridge for the Biblically sound gospel preaching and teaching of Dr. Kennedy.  To slander his daughter as you have done is definitely unchristian.  Perhpas you will spend some time in prayer to ask forgiveness  It's time to seek God's face and the truth.

Irene who are you to say that God is not pleased? Are you God? No I don't think so. So don't speak for him. You and those members are surely adding to the content of this controversy. STOP THE GOSSIP!!! EMBRACE THE CHANGE!!! STOP COMPLAINING!!! STOP PLAYING GOD!!! PUSH, PULL OR GET OUT OF THE WAY BECAUSE GOD CANNOT BE STOPPED!!! THINK OF THE POSITION TULLIAN TCHIVIDJIAN IS IN!!! WOULD YOU WANT TO BE HIM GOING THROUGH ALL THIS STRIFE AND CONTROVERSY?! WHAT KIND OF EXAMPLE ARE WE SHOWING TOWARDS NEW MEMBERS COMING TO OUR CHURCH? I WOULD WALK RIGHT OUT OF THE DOOR IF I WAS VISITING CRPC. I HAVE MY FAMILY IN TOWN FROM A GREAT DISTANCE AND AM FRANKLY NOT HAPPY ABOUT TAKING THEM TO CHURCH. I AM EMBARRASED.

All this religious psychobabble is taking away from the real mission of the church: TO CARRY GOD'S WORD TO EVERY LIVING NATION ON EARTH. To all the naysayers: if you really believe this is going to enhance the kingdom of God then you are sorrily mistaken. We all need to examine ourselves before pointing the finger at others.

Am I the only one disheartened by the turn these comments have taken in the past few days?  Saying "Just stop complaining and accept it" isn't really going to help matters.  Neither is self-righteously responding with "Spend some time in prayer to ask forgiveness."  Have we all gone mad? 

Irene said, "Many of your comments and those of the other blogger indicate a lack of knowledge about what is truly transpiring."  Umm, okay.  So why don't they write an open letter to the congregation informing them/us of what has really happened?  Oh, wait they did.  (Or didn't - but the writers could not have been so naive as to think that letter would stay only in select circles, nevermind the fliers on our windsheilds.)  Responding to that and defending one's pastor is hardly a sin. 

I wish the writers of the letter would have shown a little more discernment in handling this matter.  They could have been discreet, and perhaps they were at first.  Perhaps they felt as though their backs were against the wall.  Whatever they felt, there are appropriate channels in place (In the Bible and the Book of Church Order) to prevent these very circumstances.   I hope these matters are laid to rest at the meeting Friday night.

My prayers are with the church.  Lets get past this so we can carry on with Kingdom work.

Phil,

    you said, "A number of dissenting members believe their elected officers (Elders and Deacons) are taking CRPC in the wrong direction".....

Well wasn't it Ms.Kennedy and your top people who elected these gentlwemen in the first place? Did not see any flyers going out about the Decons and Elders leading CRPC down the wrong path before Tullian was elected did I? What happened! These respected gentlemen got zapped and now all of a sudden they are not caple of making rash decissions?

Betsy,

     91% wanted Tullian and the merger. Only 5 people put out a letter....This should tell you something. Have you not heard any of Tullian's message from the Jonah series. Jonah was tribal and traditional, but God had other plans. God has great plans for CRPC, whose membership was dropping (from 10K in the early days down to 2K today).

    You said, "I, like many others, didn't think a merger was necessary".Whay do you mean by this? Was not New City welcome to  join your congrgation?

  You said, "When somebody buys a successful existing business, the first rule is to change nothing". CRPC is not a succesful business. There was much economic waste on CRPC's part. You had many people paid to do jobs that were being done by volunteers at New City for free. You had many people that were doing overlapping jobs. Some of these jobs were reduced and reorganized and now being done by a single person or department. With a little more effort, I believe CRPC will be running  in the "black".....A succesful business does not drop from 10K down to 2K... And let me add, that when a business does buy another business, it is customery for the workers of the business beening bought to submit resignation letters.

And back off Aram.....If you are upset by his post...then you have a problem....this is clearly a joke. but I guess some people don't get it!!!!

GO GOD! GO GOD! GO TULLIAN! GO TULLIAN!

Wow if I wanted to join the circus I would have gone to Ringling Bros. Barnum and Bailey.

 I wonder how many from the 6 names that were signed on "the letter" did the Matthew 18 thing and approached/confronted their brother, pastor or elders.  When you point a finger at someone...4 are pointing back to yourself. "We are all sinners... but He is a great Savior." Clearly, we are a family of believers... maybe a bit dysfunctional but that is another blog. We are all well-intending people following our hearts... keep praying that God will fill our hearts (that all need surgery) with His Spirit.

 We do need to extend GRACE as far as Christ did on the cross....we also need to watch out because we all seem to be tripping over the cross and in the name of the cross trying to control what is God's will for CRPC. It seems that our 2x unanimous elders of CRPC has stated and affirmed that the calling of Rev.Tullian Tchividian has been called to this church is the will of God. So... as the wise woman Edna? at our Congregational Meeting said months ago... "I'm not a Dr. & don't have any big credentials but I do have common sense... and if the God- ordained session and elders have approved this man of God who am I to stand in the way. " 

"Blessed are the peacemaker... for they shall be called sons of God."

Hope to see a huge crowd tonight whether you are for or against  (which is such a strange and sad thing to say you are against a man of God) but hopefully all will be there with a open heart and mind so our church can just throw up and feel better.   : )

Sandy Hall

"I am stunned that all these opinions thrown out here have been done by people who didn't call or talk to any of the five people whose names are on the letter.  Many assumptions have been made here bringing the writers to totally wrong conclusions . . . I have only spoken to three of the five names on the letter, so I won't go in to any opinions until I have gotten ALL the facts. But, I can tell you many "facts" stated here are not "facts"."    -  Betsy

Betsy, why is calling those names on the letter so important and what makes you think we don't know all the facts? Were not all the facts in the letter? If you want to write a letter opposing someone you don't usually omit pertinent information, but maybe that's just me.

“That is why it is called a Traditional service, because it is the tradition of CRPC to worship in that manner, in that order. ”

That's right and there's nothing wrong with the traditional service and Tchividjian has made it abundantly clear from the pulpit that the traditional service isn't going anywhere. Having said this, however, traditions are nice but no one group of people should ever try to force their own traditions on someone else. The group at CRPC has a long history of these “traditions” and by opposing any change that takes place (like with the minister's preference not to wear a robe) they are forcing their traditions on him and Jesus Himself says that this is wrong. The Pharisees in Jesus own day had a long list of traditions as well and when Jesus began his ministry he didn't wait an entire year to begin making changes, he acted immediately:

“"Why do your disciples break the tradition of the elders? They don't wash their hands before they eat!" Jesus replied, "And why do you break the command of God for the sake of your tradition?” - Matthew 15:2-3

Jesus didn't say that tradition was a bad thing. But clearly he had no problem making changes and setting new traditions. They through a fit when Jesus healed someone on the Sabbath day, because this went against their tradition. By doing so though, they completely missed an awesome act of God and the profound impact this miracle and others like it had on the outreach of the surrounding communities and how many came to know the Lord through these acts. We should be careful not to do the same in our day.

“They worship me in vain; their teachings are but rules taught by men. You have let go of the commands of God and are holding on to the traditions of men.” Mark 7:6, 7

If the only way people can worship God is in the comfort of their own traditional bubble then their worship is in vain like this verse states. By doing so they have let go of the commands of God and are holding on to the traditions of man as their authority. As protestants, we should be very concerned that a church in our midst is holding to their traditions instead of allowing God to work great and mighty things through changes since this is why we call ourselves protestants in the first place. One of the great sins of Rome is the pedestal they put their traditions on and look to it as a source of authority.

Colossians 2:8 says, “See to it that no one takes you captive through hollow and deceptive philosophy, which depends on human tradition and the basic principles of this world rather than on Christ.

Sandy,

   Amen to that!

Andy W.

PS....Cathedrals have tried in vain
To show the image of your face.
But we are, by your design,
The signature of divine.

We'll always sing your name.
Forever and today.

Yahweh, Yahweh...
Great is your glory when you go before me
Oh, we sing...
Holy, Holy...
Your ways are lovely. So high above me.
Yahweh

The fortunes of kings and queens
Are wasted chasing what we've seen.
Cause we are, by your reprieve,
The beauty framed by your suffering.

We'll always sing your name.
Forever and today.

Yahweh, Yahweh...
Great is your glory when you go before me
Oh, we sing...
Holy, Holy...
Your ways are lovely. So high above me.
Yahweh

Take me, and pull me through.
Cause I can't move without you.
I won't leave you alone, you say.
It will be okay.

Yahweh, Yahweh...
Great is your glory when you go before me
Oh, we sing...
Holy, Holy...
Your ways are lovely. So high above me.
Yahweh.
Yahweh, Yahweh...
Great is your glory when you go before me
Oh, we sing...
Holy, Holy...
Your ways are lovely. So high above me.
Yahweh

Ancient of Days...
Yahweh!
(Song By Needtobreath)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YuYcrR7c9Mo

Stephen,

   Amen to your last post also. Sorry I am in a song mode, but your post reminds me of that old MWS song, "Secret Ambition"...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1BRUsSztA44

(Michael W. Smith)

Young man up on the hillside
Teaching new ways
Each word winning them over
Each heart a kindled flame
Old men watch from the outside
Guarding their prey
Threatened by the voice of the paragon
Leading their lambs away
Leading them far away

Chorus:
Nobody knew His secret ambition
Nobody knew His claim to fame
He broke the old rules steeped in tradition
He tore the Holy Veil away
Questioning those in powerful position
Running to those who called His name
(But) Nobody knew His secret ambition
Was to give His life away

His rage shaking the temple
His word to the wise
His hand healing on the seventh day
His love wearing no disguise
Some say Death to the radical
He's way out of line
Some say Praise be the miracle
God sends a blessed sign
A blessed sign for troubled times

Chorus:
Nobody knew His secret ambition
Nobody knew His claim to fame
He broke the old rules steeped in tradition
He tore the Holy Veil away
Questioning those in powerful position
Running to those who called His name
(But) Nobody knew His secret ambition
Was to give His life away

no, no
no, no
i tell you nobody knew,
untill he gave his life away
 

Andy W.

Hey,

    I caught this guy posting an anti-Tullian flyer on my car last Sunday, so i took a picture of him....

Does anybody know who he might be and why is he against Tullian?

"V"

That pic above is that old man's wife and she just saw a clip of Tullian saying "God cannot be stopped."

Funny how nobody that signed that letter was at the town hall meeting. I hear some of them went to see an opera concert that they already had tickets to. Well you know what? If you put yourself out there like that, you sign a letter and these matters are that important to you then you need to show up. All of those people have completely lost my respect and have no credibility as far as I'm concerned. If you went to an opera and that was your excuse for not being there then sell your tickets. Otherwise shame on you.

So what happened at the Meeting?

 Good point Dexter... I did not see any of them either... this was their chance to hear first hand and they did not come... that just shows they do not want answers, forgiveness, healing, reconciliation etc... they just want him gone. I believe enough people were there with a prayerful heart to hear answers and help put out the rumors... for the ones with such big concerns not to come... it was a missed opportunity and their true intent was revealed.

Sandy Hall

Why does God have to be on Tullian's side or Jennifer's side. Why can't we be on His side and examine our own hearts before Him?

Amen Sandy!

"A Sister in Christ,"

I agree with you. We should all want to be on GOD'S side and not continue to say that "God is in this place" or "God is on our side," like we continue to hear from the pulpit every week.

"Tom Bigsby,"

Matthew Cochrane brought this issue to true public awareness. And Plus, I am not the one having a problem with Matthew. According to you, everyone who comments on this blog, or any other, is blaspheming one way or the other; so that includes you. Comments are comments. Writing a whole article on one person, instead of the intended subject, is blaspheming and being biased not commenting.

"John Wojcik,"

Are you saying that God is on Tullian's side or are you saying Tullian is God? You should be VERY careful, both are serious situations. WE want to be on GOD'S side.

"Sandy Hall,"

Did you reask Tullain at that Town Hall meeting yesterday why he has not yet done anything with your request to have the Christian rap-rock artist "tobyMac" perform a concert at CRPC? Didn't he say "yeah" he would do it at the first Town Hall months ago? Additionally, the true intent of the six who signed the letter is to glorify God by having a real pastor that will preach the gospel and not just say the word "gospel" 50 times and never define it. (Isn't "gospel" a noun; therefore shouldn't it have a definition??) And also it is to have a pastor that shared that gospel to more than 1 person in his life time that was not an incident situation back in 2007. Are you aware that CRPC's main ministry is EE? Tullian is taking that away because is offends him to have regular "lay"people, members of the congregation or not, to have shared the gospel more times than himself!!!

Over all, did you all have a good time "defending" the pastor yesterday? I am sure he appreciated your efforts to protect him from simple questions...  :P

(I <3 God's people; but not their sin...)

  Are you aware that CRPC's main ministry is EE? Tullian is taking that away because is offends him to have regular "lay"people, members of the congregation or not, to have shared the gospel more times than himself!!!  -  Why does it concern you?

If that is true why did Pastor Tullian announce that the ONLY change to be made with the EE program at CRPC would be to increase it from two times per week to three times per week.  Does that really sound like the actions of a man who is ""offended" by EE?

Come on, now, don't you think it's really time to start telling the truth here on this and the other subjects?

"And also it is to have a pastor that shared that gospel to more than 1 person in his life time that was not an incident situation back in 2007"

Just so you know, he was asked about this last night, so obviously this is an issue going around among dissenters. I don't know the story behind it, though. However, last night his answer to "when was the last time you led somone to Christ" was after a bit of thought  "about two and a half weeks ago in my office when counseling someone I led them to Christ". Maybe not verbatim, but that's the gist of what he said.

"John"

Why was Tullian's answer to the PNC, "I only share the gospel to one person back in 2007 in an incident." ? Why did he, in a one to one conversation, tell a member of CRPC that he does not plan on attending any EE training because he did a kid's version once back in high school. What makes you think that he is telling the truth when he tells an individual one thing than the world another?

In creasing an activity to three days in a week is a weak arguement. If he loves EE then why won't he do it?

Yes, I think the pastor should tell the truth too.

I for one am thankful for YOUR post as I was unable to attend the meeting and did not receive the letter (which I'm looking at as God's protection at this point). One point that I think may have been missed in the myriad of posts . . .

Jennifer lost her FATHER, a very prominent preacher who has undeniably reached many for Christ, yes, but her daddy too. She is hurting. She is missing him and all that he brought to her life including his ministry. As one who recently lost her own father, I know there is NO ONE who can fill his shoes nor take away the loss felt.

Perhaps that is why Tullian has not tried to fill Dr. K's shoes but to follow God's calling on his own unique ministry, and that he does so well.

As for the preaching of the gospel that is what I love MOST about Tullian's preaching. Every sermon is SATURATED with the gospel message in its entirety and it is ALWAYS captivating. I never tire of hearing it. I walk away from every sermon reminded anew of the magnificance of GOD who so loved the world that he sent his only son.

How could one miss it?  Maybe because they've heard it thousands of times another way, by another man and that is what they're longing to hear. Their earthly father's voice. Jennifer, and all those who knew and loved Dr. Kennedy, I am so sorry for your loss. May God be your comfort.

In Christ Alone,

Julie

Betsy, you forgot to mention in the post above that he also said in his answer to the question about sharing the gospel with someone one-on-one that he was on vacation with his family for the past month and that this incident where God gave him the opportunity to lead someone to Christ came in between his 2 weeks on the SW coast of FL and 2 weeks in NC when he was in his office for a day. 

I have no doubt that Tullian has a heart for the lost.  He wants to make a difference in our community and around the world.  Let's get  on with this most important business...

Here is a guy (Tullian) who planted a church 5 years ago in heavily hedonistic and heathen-rich S. Fla, and yet was drawing several hundred people to his weekly services. He had shared many times how he surrendered his life to Christ after years of rebellion, etc. etc. - and someone actually had the AUDACITY to ask him when he last led someone to Christ? I would have said to that person (politely, of course) "When you build a church from the ground up, in this area, under these conditions, and are drawing hundreds of people whose lives have been changed - then you can ask me that question"

How rude, bold and pompous! I can't believe it.  

 Not to offend any EE'ers out there, but I think Tullian's approach to sharing the gospel (living among them, etc. etc. as defined in his book) is a method of evangelism that I cannot understand why anyone would be opposed to. Why not give it a shot? As long as people are accepting Christ by seeing what the joy and beauty of the Christian life can be like, who cares what method you use?

To tell you the truth, in my neighborhood, both non-believer and believer alike cringe when they see the Mormons coming. I mean, they're nice guys and everything, but that type of door-to-door stuff - while it worked in its day and certainly may still be effective - is not the ONLY option. 

 Hey Betsy, what makes you think you were the only one to reach out to the petitioners? I called every one and got through to several. What struck me is their complete lack of understanding that their actions are totally outside of church law and in defiance of Biblical principals of conflict resolution.

Robert Taylor

 tobyMac rocks!

 Dear Why does it concern you?

Why do you assert that Rev.Tullian isn't a "real" pastor? That's very disrespectful to an individual who has quite proven himself to be a pastor through his educational degrees and ministry successes. Do you think if he wasn't a "real" pastor he would have successfully planted a church? Do you think if he wasn't a "real" pastor the majority of New City would now be worshiping at CRPC? Do you think if he wasn't a "real" pastor Dr. Os Guinness would speak at his installation service? Who are you to say that Rev.Tullian has only "shared" the gospel with 1 person in his lifetime? Who can count  how many  any of us "share" the gospel with on a daily basis? Can you see inside the hearts of the people you come in contact with every day? Can you see how their lives might be changed by how you live yours? Have you followed Rev.Tullian around for his entire life? I don't think we are in the position to keep "score" on how many lives WE change . . . it is God who does the changing.  Some plant seeds, some water but God causes them to grow.  Becoming a Christian is more involved than simply repeating a prayer. Finally, the fact that you believe EE is the main ministry at CRPC is exactly the problem. The "main ministry" at CRPC is about saving souls - who cares what it is called? In my opinion, you and your friends are way too caught up in the titles of this ministry. Don't turn it into a golden calf.

Karebear....I don't get the relevance that he led someone to Christ while inbetween vacation spots. Please explain what difference that makes. Thanks.

Geoff Dennis....to answer your quesiton, it has already been explained that some dissenters work for CRPC and fear losing their jobs, so don't want to use their names.

May God bless Tullian, his family and the new leadership during this difficult time!

I wouldn't want his job right now!

My wife and I are praying for you!

Who are you to say that Rev.Tullian has only "shared" the gospel with 1 person in his lifetime? Who can count  how many  any of us "share" the gospel with on a daily basis? Can you see inside the hearts of the people you come in contact with every day? Can you see how their lives might be changed by how you live yours? Have you followed Rev.Tullian around for his entire life? I don't think we are in the position to keep "score" on how many lives WE change . . . it is God who does the changing.  Some plant seeds, some water but God causes them to grow.  Becoming a Christian is more involved than simply repeating a prayer. Finally, the fact that you believe EE is the main ministry at CRPC is exactly the problem. The "main ministry" at CRPC is about saving souls - who cares what it is called?

Absolutely, 100 % accurate. Couldn't have said it better myself. 

A congregational meeting is being scheduled possibly in Aug. or Sept. for the purpose of dismissing Tullian. Hold on to your hats.  -  Anonymous

Hold on to your hats?  Please!  You've made this post three times now so I can only assume you're really excited over the prospects of such a meeting.  

Instead of being excited you should be ashamed that a Godly man has been allowed to be publicly maligned in such a way and you should be urging everyone to get down on their knees in prayer for the future of this church.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IgHsllPMdtg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4KMriSdmr5I

lighten up and have some fun!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U8Ev5HgGACg&feature=PlayList&p=748A889FC5F80DB1&index=2&playnext=3&playnext_from=PL

I'm amazed that D. James Kennedy's elders oversaw the hiring/merger of a pastor who was not personally involved with E.E. in his previous position.

"A congregational meeting is being scheduled possibly in Aug. or Sept. for the purpose of dismissing Tullian. Hold on to your hats.  -  Anonymous"

So then what?  I personally dont think they have half the support they think they do, but  even so...  Do you really think CR will find a pastor with the credentials of Tullian's that will come pastor a church after the way they have treated this pastor?  NOT A CHANCE!  CR better pray and pray hard or God might just give them what they've been after.

 CR better pray and pray hard or God might just give them what they've been after.  -  M

I was thinking the same thing . . . if these people really do end up getting their way in this matter then their troubles will be just beginning . . .  I can't prove this but I sense that whatever support  these malcontents might have once had is seriously eroding.  Clearly, we'll see and, just as clearly, many of us will be praying hard in the meantime. 

A congregational meeting is being scheduled possibly in Aug. or Sept. to precede this unbiblical meeting for the purpose of supposedly dismissing Tullian to stop the minority faction that is causing this rift. Actually Satan is causing this rift. The parties involved are going to use the Bible and the PCA Book of Church Order to quelch this rebellion. We are going to aggressively with God's help gain the needed signatures from the overwhelming majority that support this man of God, Tullian Tchividjian. If you apostates think you've got any prayer or hope of winning this then you are sorely mistaken. We will Biblically back up our cause until the final bell tolls. Hold onto your chairs at the meeting.

You know, I'm just a young adult who used to attend New City for years and began attending CRPC with the merger. I have never felt so disappointed in a church. I miss New City and the love I felt when I would walk in every Sunday, and I was so excited to be able to share my church family with others and watch us grow. Instead, my second time attending CRPC I had to endure a whole sermon with grown men behind me gossiping like school girls and saying hurtful things about people I consider my FAMILY.

Like I said, I'm just a young adult, and it's embarassing to see grown adults behaving this way.  If you don't like Tullian, I suggest you go shop for a new church- GOD wants him there, and unless God so deems, Tullian is not going anywhere...and neither are the original New City family because we all love God, God's will, Tullian, and the rest of the church family.

And a side note: show a little respect. Some things I have heard out of anti-Tullian people's mouths remind me of things bullies would say back in the 5th grade. Is this really what the church has come to? It wasn't this way before.

After Friday's meeting that nigth I found myself unable to sleep. I cannot wrap my brain around how peopel act sometimes. This has me tired, discouraged, ashamed, and I could go on. I get angry when people pick on a good man - not just a good man - A Man of God!. Tullian is a man of God. Pray for tullian and as far as him needing to learn humility.. I can only believe they simply DO NOT KNOW TULLIAN.  He stood in the rain at my home as a second hurricane was approaching to secure our family's plastic home.He was with ordinary men, deacons, elders, and together they all held my family's safety as a priority. I never felt such love as they helped my 98 year old grandmother  & me leave our home for some place safer.! He was a hero to me that day. And I remain confident under his leadrership. May God settle this quickly.  I pray for all involved.

Linda A W.

Kathy,

I hope you're not on the welcoming committee....

If you miss New City so much then go back and take your pastor with you.  -  Kathy

If your purpose here is to bait the conversation with remarks like this, in order to prevent honest discussion, it simply will not work.    We've all seen this tactic before a million times and we will not allow this board to degenerate into a shouting match that prevents honest give and take on issues.

If I am wrong about this and your intent was to throw light and truth into the debate then you likely failed at that as well.

Kathy, debates like this often raise strong opinions and ideas.  Please read over any future remarks before you post;  please.  Remember, we are all Christian brothers/sisters and we will be spending all of eternity together.  

Obviously, you have strong feelings on these issues and we would love to hear about them.  Please, though, keep it civil and you will find many people willing and eager for an honest sharing of ideas.

Thanks.

If you work at CRPC and are a dissenter you should have the Courage to stand up for your opinion. Is your paycheck more important than your principals. Can you be so Cowardly and Untrusting in God? God has appointed this Pastor, My Pastor! I'm offended that you hide behind your fear and trembling. SHAME ON YOU! Is God not Sovereign? Did God make a mistake that he now needs this cowardly cabal of conspiritors to rectify for Him? I THINK NOT!

Robert Audet

Kathy,

I could see none of the signers at the Town Hall Meeting anywhere. And I looked UP and DOWN Kennedy Hall. UP and DOWN I mind you and I did not see them. I know who all of them are and they should have put their words where their mouth was instead of their "behind the back computer writing" via Jennifer Kennedy Cassidy or whoever wrote it. They still have lost all their credibility and respect with alot of people whether they were at the opera or Amsterdam!!!!!!!!!! What they did was UnBiblical!!!!

You know, I'm convinced the Methodists and Catholics have it right: Their bishops assign pastors to their churches. You're stuck with whoever you get and you make the best of it. This is appalling.

 What did the five fingers say to Kathy's face? SLAP!!!!!!!!   -    Don Amato

Personally, I'm really glad to see so many different comments here with a wide variety of viewpoints.  That's healthy.  Having said that, though, I think that comments like this have run their course here.  Let's play nice . . .

I agree, John.  Thanks for trying to help keep this civil... and from becoming a shouting match,  After all, the world is watching to see how we treat each other.  (Did anyone else see on another post that the religion editor from the Sun-Sentinel had made his way to this blog?)  Please keep in mind that we are all brothers and sisters in Christ...

  Please keep in mind that we are all brothers and sisters in Christ...  -  Karebear

You know, that's a very good point.  Sometimes we think we're just here by ourselves but we're not; not by any means.  The world is watching and there is a strong possibility that some of our comments could make it into the Sun Sentinel for a whole lot more people to read.  Some of the comments here are definitely not honoring to our Christ . . . 

 Dear Concerned Youth,

Hang in there. As Tullian has well articulated this is a NEW church. There are obviously many people who are "missing" what they once had - you just expressed your feelings in a mature fashion - unlike many others.

Be encouraged - this NEW church is going to do great things in the name of the Lord - don't miss it!

I also encourage you to learn from this mess - you can clearly see the difference in how not to handle conflict and how to properly handle conflict. One thing is for sure - as your life progresses you'll face conflict all the time - it couldn't be more clear of right vs wrong on handling disagreements.

Kathy - you really need to work on that hand shake of yours

As an outsider I see that sides are being drawn in the sand and I don't think it is healthy for your church.  Too many of you, including your Pastor, are making public blogs which drags the ENTIRE Christian community into this whether you want it or not.  I think it is time for everyone to take a breather.  You all are taking this too personally and making it a battle between egos. 

Some people have a problem with Tullian.  So what??  What congregation agrees 100% with their Pastor??  I believe that Tullian and the entire church is moving too fast right now with changes.  Not everyone is ready for all the changes and it is causing a whole lot of friction between brothers and sisters.  Slow down for Pete's sake.  Enjoy once another and get to know each other.  If this is how this merger is starting out I seriously doubt you all will make it more then a couple of years.  This is suppose to be the honeymoon stage for all of you and your Pastor, not a war zone. 

City Church people and Tullian have to realize that CRPC lost a wondeful Pastor, Dr. Kennedy, that they had in the pulpit much longer then Tullian has even been in ministry. Heck, Dr. K was in ministry longer then Tullian has been alive I think.  That means the ties go really deep.  You need to respect that!! 

Tullian is young and passionate.  You CRPC folks need to be careful you don't quench his passion for God.  Someone needs to take this young man and lovingly mentor him.  Tullian will NEVER be Dr. Kennedy.  There is only one Dr. K but that doesn't mean that Tullian can't bring CRPC to another wonderful chapter in God's journey. 

Please, I beg you all.  Be gentle with each other.  I have many, many friends on both sides of the fence.  I am getting lots of emails from them that are full of hurt.  Try and work this out if possible. 

Some of you also need to work on your handshakes.  Even before the letter was sent out, some of us were told to get out and find another church.  Told to us even on a Sunday morning before worship service,  I've been here for 30 years and it hurts to see what has happened.  I don't want to leave, I am trying to embrace the change, but why is it OK for you to dismiss us so easily and not for us to respond to your hurtful comments.  What does it say about the teachings that is going on right now.  I don't know what to say, but to go to the Lord and pray that all this will be resolved for His Glory!   

Kathy,

And the comments that the Tullian detractors were not hurtful either? I ask you to examine those as well. I think I shook your hand one Sunday Kathy and it felt very cold just like all the other handskakes from the Tullian Detractors or the Tullian "In the Middle which is the most dangerous place to be" detractors.

Tim, I think the Methodists and Catholics do have it right. You give man the freedom to vote in the Presbyterian church and they screw up it up. Trust me I've seen it before it other Presbyterian churches. Some congregants almost always abuse this privilege of voting. Kind of reminds me when God shook his head at what was happening in the world right before he sent the floods and Noah and the ark.

EE IS NOT GOING ANYWHERE. EE IS NOT GOING ANYWHERE. EE IS NOT GOING ANYWHERE. EE IS NOT GOING ANYWHERE. EE IS NOT GOING ANYWHERE. EE IS NOT GOING ANYWHERE. IT DOESN'T SAY ANYTHING IN THE BIBLE ABOUT NEEDING TO WEAR ROBES. IT DOESN'T SAY ANYTHING IN THE BIBLE ABOUT NEEDING TO WEAR ROBES. THE CONTEMPORARY SERVICE IS MOVING TO MORE TRADITIONAL MEANS. THE CONTEMPORARY SERVICE IS MOVING TO MORE TRADITIONAL MEANS. THE APOSTLE'S CREED ALOT OF TIMES IN HISTORY WAS JUST USED AT BAPTISM. THE APOSTLE'S CREED ALOT OF TIMES IN HISTORY WAS JUST USED AT BAPTISM.

HMMM WHY DOES THE AUDIO TAPE OF TULLIAN'S TOWN HALL MEETING AND PREVIOUS SAYINGS KEEP PLAYING BACK AND FORTH ON MY STEREO? DARN STEREO. MUST BE A GLITCH IN THE CD. HMMMM...LET ME TRY TO FIX IT.

- John Peabody

You know, Dr. Kennedy was not without his dissenters. I remember Roger McMurrin (former music dir) telling me that one of the reasons for the years of declining membership at Coral Ridge was due to Kennedy's obsession with politics - and injecting it into so many of his sermons.

A church that went from 10,000 members to 2,000 better come up with some pretty darn good reasons to want to get rid of a new pastor who may be a little wet behind the ears and headstrong - but has ALREADY reversed years of declining attendance.    

Personally, I agreed with Kennedy's views (well, most of them) - but I don't think he went through with his detractors what you're putting Tullian through.

If ANYBODY would have told a detractor to "join us or leave" - it would have been D. James Kennedy!  

Linda A W

 For those who say TT is moving too fast, too soon!!! Let me just say.... . God's timing is PERFECT!

Unfortunately, the comments in this post, as more than commenter has remarked,  have degraded to the point of the absurd and malicious. All comments that rudely or unfairly portray any of the parties involved or spread false rumors will be aggressively deleted.  If these comments persist, the comments section for these posts will be turned off. Thank you for your understanding.

some things that are posted are ridiculous and absurd. Some ridiculous and absurd things written were meant for LAUGHING. Something that seems to be missing from CRPC.

Tulian is a man of God and brings with him so much potential for CRPC.  I pray that Tulian listens to his supporters and ignores the critical opinions of a group of close minded, miserable people who call themselves christians when in reality they are anything but.

God is in control and He is above all...I know I should be praying for all who created the petition but instead I am more irritated and disappointed.  They need to grow up. Life is full of changes, embrace the new.  Maybe you'll broaden your horizens...instead of being so closed minded.  And remember the church was not Dr. Kennedy's....it belongs(ed)s to the Lord.

There seems to be confusion about what comments are being deleted and which comments are not. Allow me to clear up some confusion. Any comments dealing with personnel issues (e.g. hirings, firings, lay-offs, etc.) will be deleted. Any comments dealing with rumors about what “somebody” told them about what might or might not have happened behind closed doors at the church will be deleted. Any comments dealing with anything that has not yet been made public by CRPC will be deleted. Any comments with rude or profane language directed at individuals will be deleted. Period. This site has not been a rumor or gossip blog for the three and a half years I’ve been blogging and it is not going to start being one now. 

Tullian,

I hope you are not reading all of this, but if you are, please continue preaching the Word.

Tullian keep preaching it brother!

Tullian you're my hero!

EE IS NOT GOING ANYWHERE. EE IS NOT GOING ANYWHERE. EE IS NOT GOING ANYWHERE. EE IS NOT GOING ANYWHERE. EE IS NOT GOING ANYWHERE. EE IS NOT GOING ANYWHERE. IT DOESN'T SAY ANYTHING IN THE BIBLE ABOUT NEEDING TO WEAR ROBES. IT DOESN'T SAY ANYTHING IN THE BIBLE ABOUT NEEDING TO WEAR ROBES. THE CONTEMPORARY SERVICE IS MOVING TO MORE TRADITIONAL MEANS. THE CONTEMPORARY SERVICE IS MOVING TO MORE TRADITIONAL MEANS. THE APOSTLE'S CREED ALOT OF TIMES IN HISTORY WAS JUST USED AT BAPTISM. THE APOSTLE'S CREED ALOT OF TIMES IN HISTORY WAS JUST USED AT BAPTISM.

HMMM WHY DOES THE AUDIO TAPE OF TULLIAN'S TOWN HALL MEETING AND PREVIOUS SAYINGS KEEP PLAYING BACK AND FORTH ON MY STEREO? DARN STEREO. MUST BE A GLITCH IN THE CD. HMMMM...LET ME TRY TO FIX IT. ANYBODY GOT A MALLET? LOL

- John Peabody

- John Peabody

Matthew,

You said: "Any comments with rude or profane language directed at individuals will be deleted. Period. "

Is the following considered rude?

"Sounds like Jennifer Kennedy Cassidy needs heart surgery instead of brain surgery.

 Just Asking,

The only thing I can say is that if you had seen the comments I deleted you would understand better.  There are plenty of comments in these threads that I do not agree with - on both sides of the issue.  I am trying to allow as many comments as possible.   I really am.  I am not saying I agree with that statement but it will be staying.  Again, if you had seen the comments I had to delete you would definitely understand a bit better. 

Did they change the name of the church to Quarrel Ridge? I heard that. Is that true?